Smarter Marketer

The real test of a solid marketing strategy is whether you understand it well enough to stress-test it, and actually use it to make a decision when it counts. And now that AI can spit out a "strategic" brief in seconds, that distinction matters more. Looking strategic and being strategic are not the same thing, and it’s starting to become obvious. In this episode, James Lawrence sits down with renowned strategist Julian Cole, Founder of Strategy Finishing School and someone who's spent his career inside the rooms where PlayStation, Snickers and M&M's strategies were crafted to talk about what good strategy really looks like and where genuinely pivotal insights actually come from. Key Takeaways: Julian's path from social and digital strategy in Australia to running strategy teams at BBH and BBDO in New York Why nailing the fundamentals matters more in an AI-powered world as the tools get ‘smarter’ and the bar for judgment goes up How to use AI as a sparring partner for strategy The four essential ingredients of any strategy: the goal, the problem, the insight and the solution Untangling business strategy, marketing strategy, brand strategy and creative strategy: what each actually does, and how they fit together What separates a genuine consumer insight from a nice-sounding observation, and why the best ones change how you see the problem entirely Practical, unglamorous ways to find insights you can get started with today War stories from behind the scenes on PlayStation and Snickers How smaller marketing teams can think more strategically without a dedicated strategist on staff Why the best strategies boil down to one clear idea that can guide creative, brand and marketing decisions Guest: Julian Cole is a strategy consultant and the founder of Strategy Finishing School. He's worked with global brands including Apple, Uber, Meta and Disney, and held senior strategy roles at BBH and BBDO in New York, where he worked on campaigns for PlayStation, Snickers, Bacardi, Mountain Dew and M&M's. Through Strategy Finishing School, he's helped thousands of strategists and marketers build the skills to develop, communicate and defend an effective marketing strategy. You can follow Julian on LinkedIn . Find Us Online: James Lawrence LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jameslawrenceoz/ Smarter Marketer Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/smarter-marketer-podcast Rocket Agency Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/ Rocket Agency LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/rocket-agency-pty-ltd/ Buy Smarter Marketer: Hardcover: https://amzn.to/30O63kg Kindle: https://amzn.to/2ZqfCWm About the Podcast: This is the definitive podcast for Australian marketers. Join Rocket Agency Co-Founder and best-selling author, James Lawrence in conversation with marketers, leaders, and thinkers about what it takes to be a smarter and more successful marketer.

Rocket Agency's Co-Founder and podcast host, James Lawrence, sits down with US-based agency-owner Jordan Slover to explore the common traits they’ve seen across high-performing marketers and marketing teams, drawing on 50 years combined experience working with over 500 businesses in Australia, the UK and the USA. Key Takeaways: Why clarity about what success looks like helps marketers stay focused Why chasing every new platform, tool or tactic can do more harm than good How a strong understanding of brand can improve long-term marketing performance Why staying close to customers is one of the most valuable things a marketer can do How genuinely considering the advice of specialists and building trust leads to stronger agency partnerships Why relentless curiosity and a genuine desire to learn are essential marketing traits How reading widely and staying across news and culture can make you a better marketer Why marketers shouldn’t rely on AI to assess strategies without applying context and critical thinking Guest: Jordan Slover began his digital marketing career at Google, working in New York and London before moving to Australia. He later returned to the United States and founded Neon Ambition, a lead generation and digital marketing agency that works primarily with professional services businesses. Neon Ambition has appeared on the Inc. 5000 list of America’s fastest-growing private companies for three consecutive years. You can follow Jordan on LinkedIn . Find Us Online: James Lawrence LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jameslawrenceoz/ Smarter Marketer Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/smarter-marketer-podcast Rocket Agency Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/ Rocket Agency LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/rocket-agency-pty-ltd/ Buy Smarter Marketer: Hardcover: https://amzn.to/30O63kg Kindle: https://amzn.to/2ZqfCWm About the Podcast: This is the definitive podcast for Australian marketers. Join Rocket Agency Co-Founder and best-selling author, James Lawrence in conversation with marketers, leaders, and thinkers about what it takes to be a smarter and more successful marketer.

AI search has moved far beyond theory. 14.3 million Australians now use ChatGPT, Gemini and Google AI Overviews to research and decide which brands they trust, often before they ever visit a website. But most marketers are still measuring the wrong metrics and applying SEO tactics that don’t fully translate to AI search. In this episode, James Lawrence sits down with Rocket’s Head of SEO & GEO, Joe Alder, to unpack exactly what Rocket has learnt after three years of research, studying the landscape, testing and optimising brands for AI search. Rather than discussing AI at a high level, this episode dives into the practical strategies that are delivering results today, including technical fixes, content strategy, brand sentiment, AI measurement and the framework Rocket uses with clients to improve visibility across different AI search tools. Key takeaways: Why AI search is already changing how customers buy The STAR framework Rocket uses to build GEO strategies The technical issues quietly preventing AI platforms from accessing many websites Why trust, reviews and third-party sources matter more than ever How to improve the information AI platforms use when describing your business Why AI referral traffic dramatically understates AI’s real commercial impact The metrics marketers should actually be measuring Real examples of brands improving AI visibility through practical changes Guest: Joe Alder is Rocket’s Head of SEO & GEO and one of Australia’s leading voices on the evolving AI search landscape. He has worked closely with Australian brands to help them navigate the shift from traditional search to AI-driven discovery, combining deep technical expertise with practical strategies for improving visibility across platforms like ChatGPT, Google AI Overviews and Gemini. You can follow Joe on LinkedIn. Find Us Online: James Lawrence LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jameslawrenceoz/ Smarter Marketer Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/smarter-marketer-podcast Rocket Agency Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/ Rocket Agency LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/rocket-agency-pty-ltd/ Buy Smarter Marketer: Hardcover: https://amzn.to/30O63kg Kindle: https://amzn.to/2ZqfCWm About the Podcast: This is the definitive podcast for Australian marketers. Join Rocket Agency Co-Founder and best-selling author, James Lawrence in conversation with marketers, leaders, and thinkers about what it takes to be a smarter and more successful marketer.

Marketing teams have never had more data available to them, yet many still find it hard (often harder than ever) to confidently answer a simple question: what’s actually driving growth? In this episode of the Smarter Marketer Podcast, Rocket Agency’s Co-Founder and Host James Lawrence sits down with Paul Sinkinson, Managing Director for APAC at Analytic Partners, to explore how marketing measurement is evolving and where marketers still get it wrong. They discuss why incrementality remains one of the most misunderstood concepts in marketing and how leading brands are balancing short-term optimisation with long-term growth. Key Takeaways: What has changed in marketing measurement over the past two years and why marketers are adopting a more holistic approach The growing challenge of fragmented platform measurement and conflicting data sources How marketers should think about attribution today and where it still provides value What incrementality really means and why it matters more than most marketers realise How marketers can build credibility with CFOs and leadership teams through better measurement Why some brands gain market share during economic downturns while others pull back How fast-growing brands can transition from performance-led growth to investing in future demand Paul’s predictions on the future of measurement, brand building and distinctive brand assets Guest: Paul Sinkinson is the Managing Director of Sydney-based global marketing consultancy Analytic Partners, which delivers customised analytics that improve sales and marketing ROI. He has over 20 years of marketing analytics experience across many of Australia’s leading brands, and was previously a Partner at the Leading Edge, and Director at Nielsen, to name a few. Follow Paul on LinkedIn . Find Us Online: James Lawrence LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jameslawrenceoz/ Smarter Marketer Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/smarter-marketer-podcast Rocket Agency Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/ Rocket Agency LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/rocket-agency-pty-ltd/ Buy Smarter Marketer: Hardcover: https://amzn.to/30O63kg Kindle: https://amzn.to/2ZqfCWm

Most marketers are under pressure to deliver results fast. But when all of the focus goes into capturing demand that already exists, businesses eventually limit their ability to grow. Sustainable growth comes from balancing the customers ready to buy today with those who will enter the market tomorrow. In this episode, James Lawrence sits down with marketing effectiveness expert, entrepreneur and author James Hurman to unpack the ideas behind his new book, Future Demand. Together, they explore why so many businesses fall into the performance trap, what future demand actually means, why creativity remains one of marketing's most powerful growth levers, and how marketers can better communicate the value of long-term investment to CEOs, CFOs and boards. Visit: futuredemand.com Key Takeaways: Why businesses that focus only on short-term performance eventually hit a growth ceiling The ‘performance trap’ and how marketing teams unintentionally create it The role creativity plays in capturing the attention of future buyers Why marketers need to become better at communicating marketing's value internally Practical ways to build support for long-term marketing investment across leadership teams How companies can gradually shift from performance-only marketing to a more balanced growth strategy Guest: James Hurman is one of the world’s leading experts on marketing and advertising effectiveness. A former strategic planner, James has won more than 50 advertising effectiveness awards and was named the world’s number one strategic planning director in 2013. He is the co-founder of Tracksuit, Senior Advisor at Lions Advisory, Program Director of the Master of Advertising Effectiveness and author of Future Demand. You can follow James on LinkedIn . Find Us Online: James Lawrence LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jameslawrenceoz/ Smarter Marketer Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/smarter-marketer-podcast Rocket Agency Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/ Rocket Agency LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/rocket-agency-pty-ltd/ Buy Smarter Marketer: Hardcover: https://amzn.to/30O63kg Kindle: https://amzn.to/2ZqfCWm

Few decisions have a bigger impact on marketing performance than choosing the right agency partner. Yet according to TrinityP3's latest State of the Pitch Report, many pitch processes are still creating frustration on both sides of the table. Agencies invest significant time and resources into pitches, while marketers often struggle with unclear scopes. More than anything, this leads to relationships starting on the wrong foot before a contract is even signed. In this episode of the Smarter Marketer Podcast, Rocket Agency’s Co-Founder & Host James Lawrence sits down with TrinityP3 Founder and CEO Darren Woolley to unpack the findings from the 2026 State of the Pitch report. Together they discuss why some pitch processes consistently underperform and what marketers can do to build stronger, more productive agency relationships from the very beginning. Read: The State of the Pitch Report Key Takeaways: The biggest findings from TrinityP3's 2026 State of the Pitch report Why agency dissatisfaction with pitch processes remains stubbornly high The impact poor pitch management can have on agency performance and marketer reputation Why defining scope of work remains one of the biggest challenges in agency selection How AI and changing agency pricing models are increasing the importance of better scoping The ideal number of agencies to involve in a competitive pitch process When marketers should pitch, and when alternative approaches may deliver better outcomes The role procurement should play in agency selection and where it often goes wrong How marketers can create stronger agency relationships before a contract is even signed Best-practice feedback, communication and transparency throughout the pitch process Guest: Darren Woolley is considered a thought leader on all aspects of marketing management - a problem solver, negotiator, mentor, Founder & Global CEO of TrinityP3, industry commentator, podcaster and author. He is also an ex-chair of the Australian Marketing Institute, an ex-president of the Melbourne Advertising and Design Club, ex-medical scientist and ex-creative director. You can follow Darren on LinkedIn. Find Us Online: James Lawrence LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jameslawrenceoz/ Smarter Marketer Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/smarter-marketer-podcast Rocket Agency Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/ Rocket Agency LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/rocket-agency-pty-ltd/ Buy Smarter Marketer: Hardcover: https://amzn.to/30O63kg Kindle: https://amzn.to/2ZqfCWm

Episode Description : Most marketers are keen to try the new shiny tactic, but what if the biggest B2B marketing opportunities come from understanding what doesn’t change? In this episode of the Smarter Marketer Podcast, Rocket Agency’s Co-Founder & Host, James Lawrence, sits down with Ty Heath, Global Thought Leadership Lead at LinkedIn and co-founder of the LinkedIn B2B Institute, to explore the marketing principles that continue to drive growth in an increasingly complex world. Drawing on LinkedIn’s research and the B2B Institute’s latest work, Ty unpacks why brand remains one of the most powerful growth drivers in B2B and why many marketers are focusing on the wrong signals. Resources: LinkedIn B2B Institute Webinar: B2B Trends for the Contrarian Marketer Whitepaper: How B2B Brands Grow Key Takeaways: Why the best marketers focus on what doesn't change rather than chasing every new trend The contrarian marketer framework and how to find growth opportunities others overlook Why buyers often create a shortlist before entering the market, and what that means for brand building The 95/5 rule and why long-term brand investment remains critical for B2B growth The "sea of sameness" problem and how brands can build stronger distinctiveness The dangers of over-segmentation and the role of category entry points in reaching more buyers Hidden buyers: who really influences B2B purchasing decisions beyond the obvious stakeholders The sales and marketing alignment gap and what businesses can do to close it Guest: Tyrona Heath leads global thought leadership at LinkedIn Marketing and is the co-founder of LinkedIn’s B2B Institute. She is also a board member of the American Advertising Federation and a leading voice in B2B marketing effectiveness. Through LinkedIn’s research and partnerships with leading marketing thinkers and institutions, Ty helps marketers make clearer, evidence-based decisions about brand, memory, creativity and growth. You can follow TY on LinkedIn. Find Us Online: James Lawrence LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jameslawrenceoz/ Smarter Marketer Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/smarter-marketer-podcast Rocket Agency Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/ Rocket Agency LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/rocket-agency-pty-ltd/ Buy Smarter Marketer: Hardcover: https://amzn.to/30O63kg Kindle: https://amzn.to/2ZqfCWm About the Podcast: This is the definitive podcast for Australian marketers. Join Rocket Agency Co-Founder and best-selling author, James Lawrence in conversation with marketers, leaders, and thinkers about what it takes to be a smarter and more successful marketer.

Episode Description : Is Google losing ground? How much traffic are tools like ChatGPT really driving? And what does visibility look like when answers increasingly happen inside AI platforms instead of on your website? In this episode, Host James Lawrence sits down with Rocket’s Head of SEO & GEO, Joe Alder, to unpack what’s actually happening inside AI search in Australia right now. Drawing on Rocket’s latest GEO research across more than 150 Australian businesses and over one million data points, they explore how platforms like ChatGPT, Google AI Overviews, Gemini and Perplexity are reshaping visibility, influence and digital measurement for brands, and what marketers should focus on next. Watch our webinar: AI Search in Australia 2026 - How to Rank in ChatGPT & Google AI Key Takeaways: Why Google search traffic is declining even while total search activity continues to grow How AI Overviews are impacting click-through rates for brands ranking in top Google positions What Rocket’s research revealed about the overlap between Google rankings and ChatGPT visibility Why ChatGPT influences purchasing decisions far beyond the traffic it directly sends to websites The growing importance of brand perception inside large language models Why AI search optimisation requires a different approach to traditional SEO The technical website issues preventing many brands from appearing in AI search results What types of content are performing best inside large language models Why authority, citations and off-site brand signals matter more than ever in AI search The metrics marketers should actually be tracking to measure AI search performance Guest: Joe Alder is Rocket’s Head of SEO & GEO and one of Australia’s leading voices on the evolving AI search landscape. He has worked closely with Australian brands to help them navigate the shift from traditional search to AI-driven discovery, combining deep technical expertise with practical strategies for improving visibility across platforms like ChatGPT, Google AI Overviews and Gemini. You can follow Joe on LinkedIn. Find Us Online: James Lawrence LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jameslawrenceoz/ Smarter Marketer Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/smarter-marketer-podcast Rocket Agency Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/ Rocket Agency LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/rocket-agency-pty-ltd/ Buy Smarter Marketer: Hardcover: https://amzn.to/30O63kg Kindle: https://amzn.to/2ZqfCWm About the Podcast: This is the definitive podcast for Australian marketers. Join Rocket Agency Co-Founder and best-selling author, James Lawrence in conversation with marketers, leaders, and thinkers about what it takes to be a smarter and more successful marketer.

Episode Description: As attribution becomes less reliable and marketing teams face more pressure to prove what drives growth, marketing mix modelling is becoming a popular way to understand the full commercial picture behind marketing performance. In this episode, James Lawrence speaks with Henry Innis, CEO and co-founder of Mutinex, about how modern MMM can help marketers move beyond channel-level reporting and last-click attribution. Henry explains why media alone rarely tells the full story, how variables like pricing, promotions, competitor activity, economic shifts and brand equity influence results Key Takeaways: Why Marketing Mix Modelling is becoming more important as attribution signals weaken How MMM helps marketers understand growth beyond media performance alone The role of external factors like weather, CPI, fuel costs and competitor spend in performance How modern MMM can support faster, more confident decision-making How AI is reducing the effort required to structure data, run models and generate insights Why brand activity can contribute to both short-term sales and long-term memory effects Why siloed measurement often leads to siloed execution How marketers can use MMM to think more like capital allocators than channel operators Guest: Henry Innis is the CEO and co-founder of Mutinex, a marketing measurement company helping brands improve growth decisions through modern Marketing Mix Modelling. Mutinex’s Growth OS platform brings together media, pricing, promotions, brand and external market factors to help organisations understand what is really driving business performance. Henry offers a practical perspective on marketing effectiveness, attribution, AI and how measurement is evolving for modern growth teams. You can follow Henry on LinkedIn . Find Us Online: James Lawrence LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jameslawrenceoz/ Smarter Marketer Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/smarter-marketer-podcast Rocket Agency Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/ Rocket Agency LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/rocket-agency-pty-ltd/ Buy Smarter Marketer: Hardcover: https://amzn.to/30O63kg Kindle: https://amzn.to/2ZqfCWm About the Podcast: This is the definitive podcast for Australian marketers. Join Rocket Agency Co-Founder and best-selling author, James Lawrence in conversation with marketers, leaders, and thinkers about what it takes to be a smarter and more successful marketer.

Episode Description: What does a great agency relationship actually look like when pressure on marketing performance has never been higher? As budgets tighten and expectations rise, the difference between an average agency partnership and a high-performing one often comes down to how well both sides work together, not just what’s delivered. In this episode, Host James Lawrence sits down with Jordan Slover, founder of one of the fastest-growing agencies in the US, Neon Ambition, to unpack what it really takes to get the best out of your agency partners. Drawing on years of experience on both the agency and client side, they explore the habits, behaviours and expectations that separate strong, results-driven relationships from the ones that quietly fall apart. Key Takeaways: Why agreeing on clear goals and KPIs upfront sets the foundation for better performance How feedback, both positive and constructive, shapes stronger agency output over time What separates a true partnership from a transactional client-agency relationship The role of trust, and why over-directing your agency can limit results How transparency from the client side leads to better decision-making and outcomes Why consistent communication (without micromanaging) keeps things moving forward The importance of staying involved, even when you’ve outsourced execution How small human factors (respect, empathy, rapport) impact performance more than you think Guest: Jordan Slover is the founder of Neon Ambition, a US-based digital agency specialising in paid media, SEO and content marketing. With a background at Google and experience working across international markets, Jordan brings a practical, grounded perspective on how agencies and clients can work better together to drive meaningful results. You can follow Jordan on LinkedIn . Find Us Online: James Lawrence LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jameslawrenceoz/ Smarter Marketer Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/smarter-marketer-podcast Rocket Agency Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/ Rocket Agency LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/rocket-agency-pty-ltd/ Buy Smarter Marketer: Hardcover: https://amzn.to/30O63kg Kindle: https://amzn.to/2ZqfCWm About the Podcast: This is the definitive podcast for Australian marketers. Join Rocket Agency Co-Founder and best-selling author, James Lawrence in conversation with marketers, leaders, and thinkers about what it takes to be a smarter and more successful marketer.

Episode Description: How should Australian marketers adapt their approach to influencers and content creators as algorithmic changes, platform shifts and changing audience expectations reshape the landscape? Host James Lawrence sits down with Trish McGee, Group Account Director at Impact Agency, to unpack the findings of Impact's 2026 Influencer Pulse Check, Australian research that goes straight to the source, surveying local content creators from micro to mega. From platform preferences and AI concerns to what good measurement looks like, this is a valuable listen for any marketer working in or considering the influencer space. Key Takeaways: Why authenticity and long-term partnerships remain the foundation of effective influencer marketing How creators are using AI, and why they're cautious about brands that rely on it too heavily Which platforms creators prefer for paid collaborations versus organic content Why giving creators genuine creative control leads to better outcomes, and why it's harder than it sounds How measurement is evolving beyond reach, with saves, shares and quality comments becoming stronger indicators of success Why white-listing is still meeting resistance from creators Where Australia sits in the global influencer landscape, and why there's still significant room to grow Read: The 2026 Influencer Pulse Check Report Guest: Trish McGee is Group Account Director at Impact Agency, a full-service communications agency headquartered in Sydney. Trish leads client strategy and partnerships while overseeing Impact's Victorian presence. She was a key driver behind the 2026 Influencer Pulse Check, which surveys Australian content creators across all tiers on how they're navigating AI, changing algorithms, brand partnerships and the road ahead. You can follow Trish on LinkedIn . Find Us Online: James Lawrence LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jameslawrenceoz/ Smarter Marketer Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/smarter-marketer-podcast Rocket Agency Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/ Rocket Agency LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/rocket-agency-pty-ltd/ Buy Smarter Marketer: Hardcover: https://amzn.to/30O63kg Kindle: https://amzn.to/2ZqfCWm About the Podcast: This is the definitive podcast for Australian marketers. Join Rocket Agency Co-Founder and best-selling author, James Lawrence in conversation with marketers, leaders, and thinkers about what it takes to be a smarter and more successful marketer.

Episode Description: What would great marketing look like in Australia this year, especially when the rules are changing faster than most teams can keep up? In this episode, Rocket Agency’s top experts unpack the biggest shifts shaping digital marketing in 2026, from AI search and zero-click behaviour to rising costs, evolving content expectations and the growing importance of creative. Host James Lawrence discusses marketers’ most pressing questions with Mariano Di Lascio (Head of Digital), Joe Alder (Head of SEO), Leesa Mealing (Digital Creative Lead) and David Lawrence (MD). What follows is a practical, honest look at what’s working, what’s not and where marketers should be focusing next. Key Takeaways: Key trends shaping the Australian marketing landscape this year If zero-click search continues to grow, how should marketers measure SEO success differently? With AI-generated content flooding the internet, what does “good” content look like now? One AI use case that’s genuinely delivering ROI? With CPCs rising and competition intensifying, what are the first three levers you’d pull before increasing budget? If you’re leading marketing in 2026, what are you actually automating with AI, and what are you deliberately keeping human? LinkedIn for B2B: are most brands under-investing in creative, targeting, or measurement? Is the funnel broken or are marketers just running the same message at every stage? If you’re a lean team with limited budget, what’s the one channel and one capability you would prioritise this year? With Meta and Google controlling audience data, how much should brands invest in building owned channels right now? … and more pressing questions. Guests: Mariano Di Lascio leads a team of outstanding marketers at Rocket Agency across paid search and paid social channels. Together with the team, he has won some outstanding awards for client campaigns, including Best Integrated Campaign at APAC Search Awards, Best Integration of Search into Cross-Channel Marketing at Search Engine Land Awards and Best Integrated Campaign at Semrush Awards. Joe Alder is an award-winning SEO expert and has driven organic growth for global brands like Amazon, Coca-Cola, ANZ and Dulux through innovative strategies and data-driven insights. With over 20 industry award nominations, Joe is recognised as a leader in the field. Leesa Mealing is the Digital Creative Lead at Rocket, bringing over 15 years of experience across creative direction, art direction and design. She blends big-picture thinking with hands-on execution, shaping concepts while staying close to the work. Her background spans everything from branding and packaging to UI/UX, content and campaign production, and she’s just as comfortable leading a shoot as she is refining the details on screen. David Lawrence is the MD and Co-Founder of Rocket, an award-winning Australian full-service digital marketing agency. He is also the co-author of the Amazon #1 best-selling marketing book, Smarter Marketer. David has presented at several events, including Inbound Boston, Search Marketing Summit, Mumbrella360, CEO Institute, and various seminars and in-house sessions. Find Us Online: James Lawrence LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jameslawrenceoz/ Smarter Marketer Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/smarter-marketer-podcast Rocket Agency Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/ Rocket Agency LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/rocket-agency-pty-ltd/ Buy Smarter Marketer: Hardcover: https://amzn.to/30O63kg Kindle: https://amzn.to/2ZqfCWm About the Podcast: This is the definitive podcast for Australian marketers. Join Rocket Agency Co-Founder and best-selling author, James Lawrence in conversation with marketers, leaders, and thinkers about what it takes to be a smarter and more successful marketer.

How do you market an ‘unglamorous’ business where your category doesn’t sell itself? And what does it take to build a brand that people trust and remember when your offering is not something buyers get excited about? Host James Lawrence sits down with Lisa Macqueen, CEO of Cleancorp, to unpack how she’s built one of Australia’s most respected service brands in one of the most commoditised categories there is - commercial cleaning. From personal branding and LinkedIn content that genuinely resonates, to building trust at scale through culture and customer experience, this conversation is a masterclass in doing the fundamentals exceptionally well. Key Takeaways: How to build brand influence in a “boring” industry where buyers see the service as a grudge purchase Why founder-led LinkedIn content can become one of the most effective marketing channels in B2B What happens when you deliberately position your brand differently from the rest of your category Why putting people at the centre of your marketing can strengthen both culture and client relationships The role authenticity plays in building trust with prospects before a sales conversation even begins How modern buyers research suppliers before they ever contact a company Why curiosity and experimentation are becoming essential traits for marketers in a fast-changing landscape Guest: Lisa Macqueen is the CEO of Cleancorp, a national commercial cleaning business servicing some of Australia’s most recognisable brands. With a background in sales and marketing across global hotel and resort businesses, Lisa brought a fundamentally different mindset into an industry long defined by commoditisation. Under her leadership, Cleancorp has grown into a people-first, values-led organisation, earning B Corp certification, national recognition as one of Australia’s best places to work and a reputation for doing things differently. Lisa is also a LinkedIn Top Voice, using her personal platform to share candid insights on building meaningful brands in unexpected places. You can follow Lisa on LinkedIn . Find Us Online: James Lawrence LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jameslawrenceoz/ Smarter Marketer Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/smarter-marketer-podcast Rocket Agency Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/ Rocket Agency LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/rocket-agency-pty-ltd/ Buy Smarter Marketer: Hardcover: https://amzn.to/30O63kg Kindle: https://amzn.to/2ZqfCWm About the Podcast: This is the definitive podcast for Australian marketers. Join Rocket Agency Co-Founder and best-selling author, James Lawrence in conversation with marketers, leaders, and thinkers about what it takes to be a smarter and more successful marketer.

If most B2B buyers already know who they’re going to choose before they even speak to sales, what does that mean for your B2B marketing strategy? In this episode of the Smarter Marketer Podcast, James Lawrence sits down with Stuart Jaffray, Managing Director of Green Hat, to unpack the latest findings from the APAC B2B Buyer Journey Research Report. With data from over 800 buyers across the region, the message is clear: the rhythm of B2B buying has changed under the current economic and technological conditions. Read Green Hat’s report: The APAC B2B Buyer Journey Research Report 2025 Key Takeaways: What happens before a buyer speaks to sales, and why that’s where most decisions are actually made Why “demand generation” might really just be demand capture The changes in buying group size and timing, and what’s driving it How AI is accelerating first contact, even as buyers try to self-serve What a Millennial and Gen Z-led buying committee expects from your content Why ungating content is uncomfortable but increasingly necessary The one metric revenue teams should prioritise over MQLs Guest: Stuart Jaffray is the Managing Director of Green Hat, a specialist B2B marketing agency operating across the APAC region. He’s spent his career working at the intersection of brand, demand and revenue, helping complex organisations align marketing and sales around how buying decisions actually get made. Previously he has steered strategy and growth at global advertising giant Starcom and shaped premium brand experiences at BMW Australia, bringing a deep understanding of customer behaviour, brand positioning and commercial impact. With this blend of big-brand marketing and agency-led demand acceleration, Stuart brings a commercial and strategic lens to B2B growth. You can follow Stuart on LinkedIn . Find Us Online: James Lawrence LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jameslawrenceoz/ Smarter Marketer Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/smarter-marketer-podcast Rocket Agency Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/ Rocket Agency LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/rocket-agency-pty-ltd/ Buy Smarter Marketer: Hardcover: https://amzn.to/30O63kg Kindle: https://amzn.to/2ZqfCWm About the Podcast: This is the definitive podcast for Australian marketers. Join Rocket Agency Co-Founder and best-selling author, James Lawrence in conversation with marketers, leaders, and thinkers about what it takes to be a smarter and more successful marketer.

In this episode of the Smarter Marketer Podcast, Host James Lawrence sits down with Alex Hayes, Founder of Clear Hayes, to unpack what it really means to market to marketers. From building Clear Hayes House at SXSW Sydney to launching award-winning branded content for global platforms, Alex shares hard-earned lessons from both sides of the fence; as a former editor of B&T and Mumbrella, and now as a global B2B communications specialist. Key Takeaways: Why “don’t be boring” is more than a tagline in B2B Are we overcomplicating marketing when simplification might be the real edge? How brand and performance work together, and why future demand matters What marketers need to do to reposition themselves inside the C-suite Why upskilling in fundamentals is becoming a non-negotiable Guest: Alex Hayes is the Founder of Clear Hayes, a B2B communications agency specialising in marketing to marketers. Before launching the agency, Alex was Editor of both B&T and Mumbrella, where he covered some of the industry’s biggest stories and built a deep understanding of the people behind the platforms. Today, Clear Hayes works with clients across Australia, New Zealand, the UK, the US and Europe, helping brands connect with marketers in ways that are engaging and strategically sharp. Alex brings a rare perspective shaped by journalism, global industry exposure and years spent helping marketing brands cut through in a crowded, often self-referential category. You can follow Alex on LinkedIn . Find Us Online: James Lawrence LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jameslawrenceoz/ Smarter Marketer Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/smarter-marketer-podcast Rocket Agency Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/ Rocket Agency LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/rocket-agency-pty-ltd/ Buy Smarter Marketer: Hardcover: https://amzn.to/30O63kg Kindle: https://amzn.to/2ZqfCWm About the Podcast: This is the definitive podcast for Australian marketers. Join Rocket Agency Co-Founder and best-selling author, James Lawrence in conversation with marketers, leaders, and thinkers about what it takes to be a smarter and more successful marketer.

When the pressure for short-term results keeps getting louder, how and why should you still emphasise creativity? In this episode of the Smarter Marketer Podcast, James Lawrence sits down with Jules Hall, CEO and Founder of The Hallway, to unpack how creativity, data and commercial thinking need to work together if brands want sustainable growth. From navigating short-termism and AI hype to building credibility with CFOs and boards, Jules shares a grounded, practical view on what effective marketing leadership looks like today, and what it takes to earn the licence to do truly great creative work. Watch Cardboard Cake - The Hallway’s Cannes Lion-winning ad B Corp - Fat Cats Key Takeaways: Why creativity isn’t at odds with commercial rigour, and why “trust me” no longer cuts it How the best marketers link brand investment to real business outcomes What AI is actually useful for inside agencies (and where humans still win) Why short-term pressure is holding marketing back and how leaders can balance both How to “market marketing” internally and earn trust across the business What the Webjet rebrand reveals about modern brand growth and measurement Why relevance to culture still matters, even in a fragmented media landscape Guest: Jules Hall is the CEO and Founder of The Hallway, one of Australia’s most awarded independent creative agencies. Since founding the agency in 2007, Jules has led work for brands including Google, Suncorp Bank, BINGE and Webjet, and helped The Hallway earn honours such as B&T Independent Agency of the Year and Campaign Asia Independent Agency of the Year. In 2024, Jules and his team won a Cannes Lion for design - a standout achievement for an Australian independent agency. You can follow Jules on LinkedIn . Find Us Online: James Lawrence LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jameslawrenceoz/ Smarter Marketer Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/smarter-marketer-podcast Rocket Agency Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/ Rocket Agency LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/rocket-agency-pty-ltd/ Buy Smarter Marketer: Hardcover: https://amzn.to/30O63kg Kindle: https://amzn.to/2ZqfCWm About the Podcast: This is the definitive podcast for Australian marketers. Join Rocket Agency Co-Founder and best-selling author, James Lawrence in conversation with marketers, leaders, and thinkers about what it takes to be a smarter and more successful marketer.

What makes people say "yes"? Rocket Agency’s Co-Founder James Lawrence sits down with Dr. Robert Cialdini, the godfather of influence and the world’s foremost authority on the psychology of persuasion, to talk about the timeless principles behind his work, his seventh principle of influence - Unity - and how AI, ethics and empathy are shaping persuasion in modern marketing. Key Takeaways: Origin story: How Dr. Cialdini went “undercover” in multiple industries to discover the universal principles of influence A walkthrough of the original six principles - Reciprocity, Scarcity, Authority, Consistency, Liking and Social Proof The 7th principle - Unity: Why bonds formed by shared identity matter today The importance of ethics: Why marketers should use persuasion techniques truthfully and responsibly Influence vs cultural differences: How different regions (e.g., Australia, Asia, Scandinavia) prioritise different principles of influence The rise of AI: How marketers are using AI to apply Cialdini’s principles The science of “pre-suasion” and how setting context before your message boosts effectiveness Real-world examples of effective use of influence and persuasion from brands like Avis, L’Oreal and Best Buy Guest: Dr. Robert Cialdini is a globally renowned psychologist and the bestselling author of Influence: The Psychology of Persuasion , Pre-Suasion , and Yes! . His groundbreaking research on why people say 'yes' has shaped the way professionals across marketing, sales, leadership and behavioral science approach persuasion. He is often referred to as the godfather of influence , and his principles of influence drive ethical influence strategies today. Find Us Online: James Lawrence LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jameslawrenceoz/ Smarter Marketer Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/smarter-marketer-podcast Rocket Agency Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/ Rocket Agency LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/rocket-agency-pty-ltd/ Buy Smarter Marketer: Hardcover: https://amzn.to/30O63kg Kindle: https://amzn.to/2ZqfCWm About the Podcast: This is the definitive podcast for Australian marketers. Join Rocket Agency Co-Founder and best-selling author, James Lawrence in conversation with marketers, leaders, and thinkers about what it takes to be a smarter and more successful marketer.

In marketing, deadlines are relentless and expectations are high. It’s critical to manage stress and make clear-headed decisions under pressure. In this episode of Smarter Marketer, host James Lawrence chats with Dr. Jemma King - founder of BioPsychAnalytics and expert in stress, resilience and high performance. Having worked with elite organisations like the Australian Olympic Swim Team, the Australian Defence Force, McKinsey and Atlassian, Dr.King shares science-backed insights on managing burnout, improving decision-making and optimising sleep for peak performance. Whether you're leading a team, juggling campaigns, or striving for balance in your personal life, this episode will equip you with practical strategies to navigate the pressures of marketing. Key Takeaways: Dr. Jemma King’s journey - How she became a leading expert in stress research and high-performance psychology. Why marketers are under pressure And the need to manage stress for long-term success Science-backed strategies to reduce stress and prevent burnout – Practical techniques used by elite athletes, military personnel and corporate leaders to stay resilient The role of sleep in peak performance - How sleep quality directly impacts decision-making, creativity and overall health. Actionable tips to improve sleep for better health: How to measure sleep quality and its effects on energy and performance. The hidden impact of alcohol on sleep cycles and cognitive function. Simple ways to eliminate sleep-disrupting distractions. How dim lighting before bedtime signals your brain to relax. The science behind a 40-degree hot bath as a sleep aid. How cutting back on sugar can significantly improve sleep quality. Beyond sleep: The next most powerful factors in resilience - regular exercise, a balanced diet, meaningful relationships, fulfilling work and financial stability. Tactical ways to build a stress-resilient life by structuring your day, improving your work environment and developing a low-stress mindset. Decision-making under pressure – How to maintain a clear, strategic mindset in high-stakes situations. Emotional intelligence & AI – The evolving role of AI in helping professionals improve emotional intelligence and make better, more rational decisions. Guest: Dr. Jemma King PhD is the founder of BioPsychAnalytics, a consultancy that helps companies, teams and individuals reduce stress, avoid burnout and make better decisions under pressure. She focuses on practical strategies to improve team performance and well-being in high-stress environments. Jemma has worked with organisations like the Australian Olympic Swim Team, the Australian Defence Force, McKinsey and Atlassian, among others. Find Us Online: James Lawrence LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jameslawrenceoz/ Smarter Marketer Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/smarter-marketer-podcast Rocket Agency Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/ Rocket Agency LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/rocket-agency-pty-ltd/ Buy Smarter Marketer: Hardcover: https://amzn.to/30O63kg Kindle: https://amzn.to/2ZqfCWm About the Podcast: This is the definitive podcast for Australian marketers. Join Rocket Agency Co-Founder and best-selling author, James Lawrence in conversation with marketers, leaders, and thinkers about what it takes to be a smarter and more successful marketer.

In marketing, there exists a fine line between influencing decisions and crossing into manipulation. The difference? One builds trust while the other erodes it. Host James Lawrence chats with Dan Monheit, Chief CX Thinker at Thinkerbell and former CEO of creative behavioural science agency HardHat, about applying behavioural science principles like default bias and anchoring to your marketing, related ethical considerations and how to draw the line between persuasion and manipulation. Key Takeaways: Dan’s journey - starting Hardhat and his interest in behavioural science Introduction to behavioural science and it’s connection to marketing What are some common behavioural biases you see everyday? -Default bias -Framing -Anchoring -Loss aversion -Effort bias Ethics in persuasion vs manipulation Navigating dark patterns How context impacts perception and shapes biases Essential behavioural science resources for marketers Guest: Dan Monheit is a leader in creative behavioural science. In 2005, he founded Hardhat, a pioneering agency that worked with top brands like Mattel, Bega Dairy, the Victorian Government, Kogan, DocuSign and Afterpay. Under his direction, Hardhat became a go-to agency for brands looking to understand and influence consumer behaviour. In October 2024, Hardhat was acquired by Thinkerbell, where Dan now serves as Chief CX Thinker, applying his expertise to elevate customer experiences through a blend of creativity and behavioural insights. Find Us Online: James Lawrence LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jameslawrenceoz/ Smarter Marketer Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/smarter-marketer-podcast Rocket Agency Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/ Rocket Agency LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/rocket-agency-pty-ltd/ About the Podcast: This is the definitive podcast for Australian marketers. Join Rocket Agency Co-Founder and best-selling author, James Lawrence in conversation with marketers, leaders, and thinkers about what it takes to be a smarter and more successful marketer.

As platforms push Performance Max, Advantage+ and new modelling systems, we’re entering a world where results often look better in-platform than they do in reality. Behind the scenes, attribution is becoming harder and marketers are being forced to rethink how they interpret success altogether. In this episode of the Smarter Marketer Podcast, host James Lawrence sits down with Rocket’s Paid Media Manager, Adrian Oguz, to unpack what truly matters when you’re running paid media in an AI-driven landscape. Adrian shares an unfiltered view on automation, performance loops, the limits of attribution and how in-house marketers can step back and measure what actually drives growth, and not just what looks good on a dashboard. Key Takeaways: Why AI-driven campaign types often optimise toward the easiest conversions, not the most valuable ones How to recognise when Performance Max has fallen into the “existing customer loop” The hidden risks of lead-gen automation and why spam leads often spike before performance improves The simple macro metrics that reveal whether your media is genuinely growing the business How channels like YouTube can drive huge results without showing any conversions in-platform Why creative is becoming the new targeting, especially inside Meta’s evolving ecosystem How to design tests that prove whether a channel is actually contributing to growth When it’s time to scale spend, and when stability matters more than chasing the next tactic Guest: Adrian Oguz is a Paid Media Manager at Rocket Agency, overseeing multi-million-dollar budgets across search, social and programmatic. With his clear, practical approach, he’s led multiple award-winning campaigns for various business types and industries across the APAC Search Awards and SEMrush Awards year after year. You can follow Adrian on LinkedIn . Find Us Online: James Lawrence LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jameslawrenceoz/ Smarter Marketer Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/smarter-marketer-podcast Rocket Agency Website: https://rocketagency.com.au/ Rocket Agency LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/rocket-agency-pty-ltd/ Buy Smarter Marketer: Hardcover: https://amzn.to/30O63kg Kindle: https://amzn.to/2ZqfCWm About the Podcast: This is the definitive podcast for Australian marketers. Join Rocket Agency Co-Founder and best-selling author, James Lawrence in conversation with marketers, leaders, and thinkers about what it takes to be a smarter and more successful marketer.