Office Matters: The BCO Podcast

In this episode of the Office Matters podcast, BCO chiefexecutive Samantha McClary speaks with BCO NextGen Ideas Competition finalists Ben Mead of Cundall and Leelou Coppleman of OD Group ahead of the competition’s grand finale on 22 October. The pair share what motivated them to enter the programme,the excitement of being shortlisted, and the challenge of preparing to present their ideas on a major industry stage. The conversation explores the transformative journey of thecompetition, from developing an initial concept to refining it through expert mentoring and intensive public speaking coaching. Without giving too much of their presentations away, Meadshares his ambition to better connect sustainability with commercial decision-making in the office sector, while Coppleman discusses the need to bring sustainability considerations to the forefront of design and procurementprocesses. Beyond the ideas themselves, this episode highlights theunique power of mentorship, collaboration and personal growth. Both finalists reflect on stepping outside their comfort zones, learning valuable communication skills and gaining confidence in sharing their vision for a moresustainable built environment. What this discussion really is, however, is a showcase ofthe passion, innovation and optimism of the next generation of industry leaders. What this discussion does , is offer a compelling preview ofwhat promises to be a standout event for the sector. So, if you haven’t yet secured your ticket for the best and most inspiring event you’ll get the opportunity to attend this year, right that wrong by booking your ticket here: https://www.bco.org.uk/product/bco-ideas-competition-finalist-showcase We promise you won’t regret it. Listen in: For an exclusive preview of innovative sustainability ideas that could help shape the future of the builtenvironment. To hear firsthand how mentoring and public speaking coaching can transform careers, ideas and confidence. To be inspired by the passion and ambition of emerging industry talent determined to create meaningful change. Huge thanks to the BCO’s NextGen Ideas Competitionsupporters, including platinum partner Knight Frank and gold partners Hawkins\Brown and NCG Global.

The commercial real estate industry spends a huge amount of time asking what occupiers want. But according to architect and strategist Fakhry Akkad, we're still missing the point. In this fascinating episode of Office Matters, Akkad, founder of architectural practice Manufacturing Taste, argues that while the sector has become highly effective at refining the supply side of the equation - designing better buildings, improving specifications and adding ever more amenities - it has paid far less attention to understanding the people those spaces are ultimately for. Drawing on lessons from consumer brands, retail strategy and behavioural psychology, Akkad explores how developers can move beyond simply following market trends and instead shape demand through meaning, identity and storytelling. From the campaign to save the former London College of Fashion building to the industry's ongoing obsession with amenity arms races, he challenges conventional thinking and asks whether real estate has become trapped in an echo chamber of its own making. This is a conversation about culture, consumer behaviour and competitive advantage. Most importantly, it's a reminder that people don't fall in love with products. They connect with stories, values and experiences. The workplaces that succeed in the future may be those that understand that best. Listen in to: Learn why developers should think more like consumer brands and less like commodity providers. Discover why amenities alone are no longer enough to differentiate a workplace. Hear a powerful argument for putting culture, meaning and human behaviour at the heart of real estate strategy. Enjoy!

In the latest episode of the BCO's Office Matters podcast host Samantha McClary sits down with Suzan Ucmaklioglu, architect and inclusive design specialist at Foster + Partners, for a candid conversation about what it really means to design inclusively. Ucmaklioglu explains the philosophy of "with, not for" - designing alongside the people who will use a space, not assuming their needs. She shares striking findings from Foster + Partners' Spaces for Inclusion research, developed with Disordinary Architecture, including how something as simple as a missing bench can drain a person's energy before they even reach a meeting. This powerful conversation covers everything from architecture education's blind spots, the power of language, and Suzan's own personal journey growing up with a wheelchair-using father. It's a warm, honest, and genuinely eye-opening listen. And one that comes with a little important homework for every listener. Listen in to: Rethink what "accessible" actually means. Compliance is a starting point, not the finish line. A building can tick every code box and still fail real users. Find out why treating accessibility as a design driver, not a checklist, produces better buildings for everyone. Discover how small interventions have outsized impact. Research across four completed Foster + Partners buildings found that entrances, toilets, and communal "urban rooms" are where inclusive design succeeds or fails most and that something as simple as adding rest spaces changes how welcome people feel in a scheme. Find out why the whole delivery chain needs to be involved. From developers and investors to fit-out teams and leasing agents, everyone shaping a building's design and operation influences who can actually use it. It’s time to make inclusive design a shared responsibility across the entire real estate value chain. You can find out more about the Space for Inclusion project by watching this film:: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bV8LIlcgOpg

What do you get when you combine a passion for workplaceprojects, a talent for problem solving and a determination to make sustainability more tangible? Lauren Lemcke. In this latest episode of the BCO Office Matters Podcast,BCO chief executive Samantha McClary sits down BCO NextGen Ideas Competition winner, AECOM's Lauren Lemcke, to talk about careers, carbon, confidence and the power of agood idea. In this 30-minute recording we find out how Lemcke was ledinto quantity surveying by an inspiring mentor, is now on a mission to inspire others to build a career in the sector, and find out more about her BCO NextGen Ideas Competition-winning CarbonLegacy concept and what, almost oneyear on, winning the competition has meant for her personally and professionally. If you missed Lemcke's powerful pitch at last year's event,her CarbonLegacy proposal seeks to tackle two challenges at once: reducing embodied carbon and creating meaningful social value. The idea is simple but powerful. By linking carbon savings to community investment, projects can be rewarded not only for doing the right thing environmentally, but for creating a positive legacy in the places where they operate. But the Ideas Competition isn't just about having a greatidea, it is about bringing it to life and in this episode Lemcke shares her inside knowledge on the process of taking an idea from a rough concept to a TED-style presentation, the value of mentoring and public speaking training, and how the NextGen Ideas Competition has opened doors to new opportunities, industry connections and greater confidence. Listen in to: Discover the story behind CarbonLegacy, the innovative idea connecting embodied carbon reduction with measurable social value. Hear a fresh perspective on quantity surveying, and why cost consultants are more critical than ever in delivering viable, sustainable workplaces. Be inspired by Lemcke’s NextGen journey, from firstentering the competition to becoming a mentor helping the next wave of industry talent. Enjoy!

The narrative around AI and the workplace is often framed asa threat to office demand, but the data tells a very different story. In this episode of the BCO’s Office Matters podcast, BCO chief executive Samantha McClary sits down with CoStar's, Patrick Scanlon, to explore why AI firms are becoming some of London's most active occupiers, what the latest leasing trendsreveal about the future of offices, and why location, connectivity and collaboration remain as important as ever. From the rise of AI clusters to the hidden signals buried in market data, Scanlon shares a data-led perspective on where the workplace market is heading next. Listen in for more on: Why AI is creating office demand, not destroying it Contrary to predictions that AI would reduce the need forworkplaces, CoStar's data shows a sharp increase in office take-up from pure-play AI companies. Scanlon highlights a tenfold increase in take-up between February and April, with firms taking significant space and, in many cases, committing to long-term occupation in London and other leading UKinnovation hubs. The real trend is a flight to location, not just quality While "flight to quality" has dominated workplace discussions in recent years, Scanlon argues the stronger driver is geography. Occupiers continue to prioritise well-connected city-centre locations with strong amenities, talent pools and transport links. Prime buildings matter, but being in the right place matters even more. Data tells the story—but context matters One of Scanlon's key messages is that market data should never be viewed in isolation. Sentiment surveys, headlines and market narratives can paint a misleading picture. By combining real-time data with conversations across the market, analysts can identify genuine inflection points and emerging trends, helping businesses make better long-term decisions in an increasingly uncertain environment. And yes, while the name of our podcast may have changed, we promise the quality of the conversation hasn’t. Enjoy.

In this episode of Workspace Unwired, BCO chief executive Samantha McClary is joined by Tobi Crosbie, founder and chief executive of Making Moves, to explore how occupier expectations are reshaping the office market. From building his business from scratch to advising clientsacross London, Crosbie shares candid insights into what today’s organisations really want from their workplaces and why. The conversation highlights a clear shift in how officedecisions are made, with C-suite leaders now more directly involved in shaping spaces that drive productivity, attract talent and reflect company culture. As hybrid working continues to evolve, Crosby explains why the traditionalopen-plan office is being rethought in favour of more flexible, human-focused environments. Ultimately, this episode paints a picture of an industryadapting quickly, where experience, design and service matter more than ever in creating workplaces people genuinely want to return to. Listen in for key insights on why: The occupier is firmly in control Decision-making has shifted to the C-suite, with a sharp focus on productivity, culture and employee experience. Workplace design is becoming more human There’s a growing demand for quieter, more flexible environments alongside collaborative space. Service and experience now rival location Inspired by serviced offices, occupiers expect higher-quality, hospitality-style environments across all building types. Enjoy!

In this episode of Workspace Unwired, BCO chief executive Samantha McClary sits down with Nicola Gillen, EMEA lead for Total Workspace at Cushman & Wakefield, and chair of the national judges for the BCO Awards, to unpack what truly defines excellence in today’s workplaces. Drawing on insights from reviewing more than 100 buildings across the UK during her four years on the BCO national judging panel, Gillen shares a unique, behind-the-scenes perspective on how offices are evolving in a post-pandemic world. The conversation explores a major shift in thinking, from inward-looking buildings designed purely for occupiers, to places that actively contribute to their communities, economies and environments. Gillen highlights the growing importance of retrofit and reuse, the rise of human-centred design that caters to diverse working styles, and the increasing role of workspace as a catalyst for innovation and regeneration beyond London. She also shares insights on why location and placemaking are more critical than ever, how the industry is responding to sustainability challenges, and why the BCO Awards process provides unmatched real-world insight by focusing on buildings that are already in use. While Gillen offers some invaluable guidance for future award entrants on how to make their submission and show-and-tell shine for judges, what this episode is really is, is a call to action. A call to design workplaces with purpose, responsibility and long-term impact in mind and to rethink what value truly means in the built environment. Listen in for key insights on why: Great workplaces go beyond the building The best projects actively shape their communities, supporting regeneration, social value and economic growth. Reuse, retrofit and sustainability are central to delivering excellence Retaining existing structures and reducing carbon is no longer optional. It’s the industry norm. Designing for people means designing for everyone Successful workspaces balance collaboration, wellbeing and focus, recognising the diverse needs of users. Enjoy! Find out more about the BCO Awards at https://www.bco.org.uk/events/awards

In this episode of the BCO’s Workspace Unwired podcast, chief executive Samantha McClary talks with Clare Fielding about inclusion, workplace design and the importance of creating spaces where everyone feels safe, respected and able to thrive. Fielding, a former planning lawyer, managing partner and now coach, reflects on her experience as a trans woman and what she describes as becoming a “reluctant activist” in response to increasingly polarised public debate. The conversation explores the complexity of current discussions around gender, legal guidance and workplace inclusion, particularly in relation to the built environment. Rather than fuelling division, Fielding argues for a more thoughtful, balanced and human-centred approach—one that starts with dignity, listening and practical problem-solving. Together, the pair discuss how designers, developers and operators can create workplaces that offer choice, comfort and safety for all, without humiliating or excluding anyone. Fielding is also a board member for Freehold, the property industry’s LGBT+ network, so utilises this episode – with the full endorsement of the BCO – to shout out the work Freehold is doing to make the property sector more inclusive. This episode isn’t really about workspace, it’s about being more compassionate in everything that we do. And, if we bring that inclusive thinking into our design, development and operation of workspaces, we’ll ultimately deliver space that works for everyone. Listen in if you want: A thoughtful, human-centred perspective on inclusion The episode cuts through noise and polarisation to focus on dignity, empathy and practical inclusion. To learn how to connect social inclusion to workplace and design decisions Listeners will hear useful ideas about how offices and shared spaces can better support everyone. Valuable sector insight from an experienced voice Fielding brings legal, leadership and lived experience, alongside insight into Freehold’s work in the property industry. Enjoy!

In this episode of BCO’s Workspace Unwired podcast, chiefexecutive Samantha McClary is joined by Gary Elliott and Georgia Elliott-Smith of Elliott Wood to explore how engineering can move from simply reducing harmto actively shaping a more sustainable built environment. Drawing on decades of experience in engineering, propertyand sustainability, the conversation looks at why engineers must act as the bridge between climate science and real-world action, and why retrofit, reuse and circular thinking are becoming essential rather than optional. Through practical examples, including the reuse of structural steel and creative ways to unlock more space within existingbuildings, the Gary and Georgia explain how low-carbon solutions can also deliver commercial value, resilience and stronger stories for occupiers and investors. The discussion also tackles the need for braver leadership,better education across the profession, and a policy environment that supports refurbishment-first thinking. This is a conversation about courage, curiosity andresponsibility, about how the built environment sector can challenge old assumptions, make smarter use of what already exists, and create workplaces that are not only lower impact, but more human, characterful and fit for the future. Listen in for key takeaways on: Why engineers are the crucial link between climate science, policy and practical delivery in the built environment. How retrofit, reuse and circular economy thinking can cut carbon, reduce waste and still create commercial value. Why courage, education and better storytelling are essential to help clients, policymakers and the wider industry embracechange. Enjoy!

In this episode of Workspace Unwired, BCO chief executiveSamantha McClary talks to Elliott Sparsis about his journey from early entrepreneurial experience in a family business to co-founding Sociable Surveyors, a global internship platform that unexpectedly created a powerful industry network. After gaining foundational experience in real estate atSavills and Blackstone, where he honed a rigorous approach to detail and execution, he moved into the flexible workspace sector with Convene, bringing a hospitality-led model to London. Sparsis now leads Together , a business designed around large-scale meeting and event spaces that blend real estate fundamentals with high-quality hospitality. He argues that post-COVID, companies are increasingly outsourcing large gathering spaces due to inefficiency and cost, creating demand for specialist venues. Together, he says, differentiates itself by delivering highly flexible, client-tailored environments with in-house services, prioritising authenticity, seamless experience, and human comfort. A key philosophy for Sparsis and the Together team is that“connection is infrastructure". He believes that as digital and AI-driven interactions increase, the value of physical, in-person experiences will also rise. And it this growing need for human connection, that he believes will see his Together business thrive. Listen in for more on: Why physical space where human interactions are enabled isrising in value Why hospitality and real estate is the future and why thetwo need to be perfectly aligned Why attention to detail is key in driving excellence incustomer experience Enjoy!

In this episode of Workspace Unwired BCO chief executive Samantha McClary talks with architect Julian de Metz about why he loves “crawling all over buildings”, why great workplace design is fundamentally about human experience rather than technical compliance and why we need to sometimes ditch the digital and be more analogue. De Metz is co-founder of dMFK, an architectural practice he founded with university friends Paul Forbes and Ben Knight, and is incredibly passionate about creating human-centred workspaces, that have culture at their heart. Bringing existing buildings back to life, working hard to find solutions, and putting real life interaction ahead of digital distraction are key to his work. Recorded less than 24 hours after GPE’s 170 Piccadilly scheme, a retrofit project worked on by dMFK, picked up the BCO London Award for Best Project up to 2,500m2, de Metz uses the building as an example of how sensitive design can reconcile heritage buildings with modern performance, creating spaces that feel uplifting, functional, and market‑appropriate. Listen in as the pair discuss design as the primary differentiator when it comes to quality workspaces, how the purpose of our offices is to build culture and why we need to work harder to unlock the untapped potential in our existing buildings. All that plus, how we balance standards and guidance with the need to encourage a more values‑led design focus and why, ultimately, if we want to deliver workspaces that work for human beings, we need to unwire ourselves from excessive digital dependency and re‑embrace physical, human interaction as the true purpose of workplace design. Enjoy.

In this episode of Workspace Unwired BCO chief executive Samantha McClary takes her portable studio to Birmingham and joins Bruntwood SciTech’s Moe Ali for a walking tour of the firm’s assets in the UK’s second city. Starting at Centre City, Bruntwood’s redevelopment of a Brutalist beast close to New Street station, the pair pound the streets of Birmingham visiting a handful of buildings from the traditional to the modern. Along the way Ali shares the Bruntwood story, unpacks the challenges and the opportunities facing Birmingham and talks candidly about the market and the firm’s own needs to pivot in times of uncertainty. Recorded live and on the go, this recording has background noises and will transport you from building to building with cut aways and jumps, but it is also full of the life and character of a bustling city. And, I guarantee that you won’t be able to help yourself being drawn in by Ali’s infectious passion for Birmingham and the assets he looks after in the city. Be bold, be Birmingham, be Bruntwood? Enjoy.

In this episode of Workspace Unwired BCO chief executiveSamantha McClary is talking to Doug Higgins, a director at Socius, and Emma Goodford, consultant adviser at Railpen, about not one but two major developments they are delivering together in Cambridge. While both Mill Yard and Botanic Place offer plenty ofworkspace, like all careful development today, both also focus heavily on creating place. An office development today has to offer more than just a place to work. It needs to be a place to thrive, a place to feel alive, to be inspired, and, say the pair, a place where you can – and should – have a little fun. The importance of the impact that places we build have onsociety runs deep through both Socius and Railpen. As a B Corp, how the Socius business impacts on society and the planet is written into its Articles of Association, and as a £35bn pension fund dedicated to railway workers, Railpenhas to make sure that its assets can continue to create value for its 350,000 members. Listen in as the trio, fuelled by Percy Pigs, explore howoccupier expectations are shifting, why amenity now extends far beyond the building’s walls, what it really takes to create workplaces that act as magnets not mandates, and how both Mill Yard and Botanic Place are intentionally prioritising community integration, local operators, flexibilityand wellbeing to ensure they deliver successful new places within Cambridge. Enjoy.

In this episode of the Workspace Unwired podcast BCO chiefexecutive Samantha McClary is talking to Patrick Dumas, founder and CEO of Square Mile Farms, about how his company is transforming offices into hubs of urban agriculture, wellbeing, and community connection. Over the course of this 40 minute conversation, recorded onlocation in London’s Paddington, Dumas shares how what began as an attempt to establish a distributed food production network across London's rooftops hasevolved into a human‑centred, experiential amenity that brings people back into workplaces—not for desks, but for shared experiences, health, and purpose. While the farms may have started as a way to help businessesdeliver on the E of their ESG strategies, Dumas says the S has become the company’s most powerful impact area. Farms attract interaction across hierarchies, while school visits, nutrition workshops, and regular harvest donations to food banks expand businesses into the local community. Listen in to find out more about how the farms work, why bigbusinesses like British Land, Vodafone and GSK are leaning and why Dumas has an ambition to become the largest farm in Europe, based entirely in London, that sells no food. And, of course, why he wants designers and developers tointegrate farms as a standard amenity in our workplaces. Enjoy.

In this episode of Workspace Unwired BCO chief executiveSamantha McClary gets a lesson in proper due diligence with Dave Bebb, a partner at specialist construction and engineering law firm Fenwick Elliott. Bebb shares insights from his extensive career in constructionlaw about how to limit the risks to projects of insolvency somewhere in the supply chain. Insolvency remains a real threat in today’s environment.Construction is still the most “critically distressed” industry in the UK, according to Begbies Traynor’s latest Red Flag Alert, with real estate and property services showing a 23.5% increase in significant financial distress in the final quarter of 2025. It is a tough world out there, but if you’re keen to knowwhat to do pre, during and post project to ensure you mitigate the risks of insolvency, then this is the podcast for you. Listen in as Bebb shares invaluable advice on how to protectyourself against one of the parties in your supply chain going bust, what signs to look out for to give you an early warning advantage for when a party may be in trouble and what to do and what not to do to keep your project on track. Invaluable advice for free. What’s not to love? Enjoy.

In this episode of Workspace Unwired Dave Cheshire,sustainability director at AECOM and author of Regenerative by Design , joins BCO chief executive Samantha McClary to make the case for regenerative design. This fascinating conversation covers everything from toiletsto civic rights for all living creatures and why delivering buildings that are “less bad” for the environment just isn’t good enough anymore. Listen in for useful examples of great practice and a lessonon how regenerative design has to become the new normal if we are reallyserious about protecting our planet. Enjoy.

In this episode of Workspace Unwired Matt Flood, development director and head of commercial development at Related Argent joins BCO chief executive Samantha McClary to talk about the firm’s Brent Cross project. The scheme, which is three times the size of King’s Cross, will deliver an entirely new settlement in the London borough of Barnet, including some 3m sq ft of offices. It is a project that underscores the importance of workspace in creating place, says Flood, with offices bringing people, industry and income to a part of London that is lacking the appropriate office stock. Residential, student and retail play a major part in the development, but with sustainability and placemaking at the heart of what Related Argent is trying to deliver at the site, offices are essential. Listen in as Flood explains the purpose behind the project and why we all need to get better at showcasing our workspaces as vital infrastructure to drive growth and to deliver places where people want to be.

In this episode of Workspace Unwired, BCO chief executive Samantha McClary sits down with Lucy Heller, chief executive of education charity Ark, and Guy Cochrane, senior asset manager for EdCity. EdCity, winner of the corporate workspace at the BCO London Awards in 2025, is the HQ of Ark, but so much more. It is the heart of a new community in White City and a building that seeks to deliver social value alongside commercial value. It is an office building that seeks to offer a “warm embrace” to anyone and everyone in the area, throwing open its doors to local residents, kids, care workers, and more while also delivering a corporate workspace fit for any business, big or small. Is EdCity the blueprint for deliverable social purpose? Listen in to find out.

In this episode of the BCO’s Workspace Unwired chief executive Samantha McClary is in discussion with the co-founder of Muslims in Real Estate and Cushman & Wakefieldsurveyor Yusuf Javaid to talk about the importance of delivering spaces that work for everyone, about how multi-use rooms are just as important as multi-faith rooms and how real estate as the potential to provide endless opportunities to everyone. Javaid shares his story of setting up Muslims in Real Estate, a network born out of the lack of Muslim representation in the real estate sector but that has grown into being an enabler of true inclusivity in the places and spaces we deliver. He shares his ambitions on how he wants to make sure MiRE to has a place at the table, so it can bring about tangible change in the industry and showcase how brilliant real estate can be when it has brilliant people in it and – spoiler alert – how you can find those brilliant people when you become a more inclusive, diverse and equitable sector. It is a fascinating listen that will almost certainly inspire you to think about the important role our spaces should and can play in driving inclusivity. If you'd like to find out more about Muslims in Real Estate, connect with the group on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/muslims-in-real-estate/

In this episode of Workspace Unwired Mark Bourgeois, chief executive of the Government Property Agency, sits down with BCO CEO Samantha McClary to talk about the transformationof the government estate, the work the agency is doing to deliver value and the challenges and opportunities he is discovering as the team works to right-size the estate. Bourgeois also shares his love for leadership and how a background in retail gave him the perfect grounding for a new career in place, which is - as we all know - what real estate is really all about. All that and so much more in your latest episode of Workspace Unwired.