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The Law, such as it is

Published by Lawrence Lessig

  • Society & culture
  • Government
  • Documentary

An exploration of a broken, if beautiful, institution, the law, and tradition, America. Season one told the story of a case, LESSIG v. NYT. Season two begins the story about a country, America, and values that country has betrayed.

Listen on Apple Podcasts, opens in a new tabMake something like it

On the charts

1 chart placement

Every published chart this podcast appears in, in the snapshot behind this page. Each one links to the chart it came off.

  1. Number 118GovernmentUnited States

From the feed

Recent episodes

The latest episodes published to this podcast’s own RSS feed. Titles and descriptions are the publisher’s.

  1. Bonus episode: NotebookLM's summary of the case (Corrected) from The Law, such as it is, opens in a new tab

    May 22, 202644 min

    In this episode, we share a podcast create by NotebookLM based on the transcripts from the 9 episodes of the podcast. It is a powerful summary of the case, which is a great introduction to the issues presented across the episodes.

  2. The Closing Argument from The Law, such as it is, opens in a new tab

    May 6, 20261 hr 52 min

    In this final episode, Lessig pulls together the argument from across the season. Why did this happen? What should happen next?

  3. Unpacking the final allegation — "Allegation 1" from The Law, such as it is, opens in a new tab

    Apr 17, 202647 min

    Allegation 1 is the only allegation within the 6 year limit for fraud investigation. In this episode, we show why it too fails — and the astonishing failure in the investigation that could have shown precisely what had happened.

  4. Unpacking "Allegation 3" from The Law, such as it is, opens in a new tab

    Apr 15, 202648 min

    In this episode, we review Allegation 3, and reveal the simple omission that undermined the investigation into this allegation.

  5. Dismantling "Allegation 4" from The Law, such as it is, opens in a new tab

    Jan 30, 202658 min

    We continue in this episode by unpacking the charges behind allegation number 4, which involved a paper written 15 years ago.

  6. Allegation 2, continued from The Law, such as it is, opens in a new tab

    Dec 1, 20258 min

    Clarifying one additional point about Allegation 2 in less than ten minutes.

  7. Dismantling "Allegation 2" from The Law, such as it is, opens in a new tab

    Nov 17, 202559 min

    So far, this podcast has considered the procedural flaws that marred the process that led to Francesca Gino's tenure being revoked. With this episode, we begin dismantling the substantive conclusions as they relate to the four alleged cases of fraud. We begin with "Allegation 2."

  8. How you know when a process has too many lawyers from The Law, such as it is, opens in a new tab

    Sep 18, 20251 hr 17 min

    In this second of two episodes interviewing Francesca, we cover the period from HBS' determination that she had committed academic misconduct through the University's decision to revoke her tenure.

  9. How You Know a Business School is Not a Law School from The Law, such as it is, opens in a new tab

    Aug 21, 20251 hr 53 min

    In this first of two episodes interviewing Francesca, we cover a bit about the nature of her work, and then the period beginning from the charges being raised against her through the business school's determination that she had committed academic misconduct.

  10. Introduction from The Law, such as it is, opens in a new tab

    Aug 21, 202524 min

    Francesca Gino was a superstar at the Harvard Business School. This year, she was fired for academic misconduct. In this season, we'll explore that story through interviews with Francesca and others. This episode introduces the story and the plan of the season.

  11. Episode 8 - System Error from The Law, such as it is, opens in a new tab

    Nov 9, 20211 hr 16 min

    Lessig talks to Rob Reich, Jeremy M. Weinstein and Mehran Sahami about their new book, SYSTEM ERROR — which unpacks the effect of technology on culture and policy, and redirects how we might respond.

  12. Episode 7 - David Vine from The Law, such as it is, opens in a new tab

    Sep 30, 20211 hr 22 min

    American University Professor David Vine has developed a powerful critique of the war mentality that America takes for granted. We argue about whether we should be a "welfare state." Why don't we argue about whether we should remain a "warfare state." In this episode, he discusses two of his books, The United States of War and Base Nation , and what lessons they teach us now.

  13. Episode 6 - Daniel Immerwahr from The Law, such as it is, opens in a new tab

    Sep 23, 20211 hr 1 min

    A discussion with Daniel Immerwahr about his book, How to Hide An Empire . The United States is not comprised solely of states. As well as states, our nation includes territories. This book tells the story of the role and place of those territories in the history of the United States. #Empire America

  14. Episode 5 - Zephyr Teachout from The Law, such as it is, opens in a new tab

    Sep 16, 20211 hr 16 min

    A discussion with Zephyr Teachout about her book, Break 'Em Up . Zephyr is the most important thinker on the Democratic left. This conversation continues from the last about how markets have been transformed from engines of freedom to systems of control. #Competition

  15. Episode 4 - Barry Lynn from The Law, such as it is, opens in a new tab

    Sep 9, 20211 hr 10 min

    A discussion with Barry Lynn about his new book, Liberty from All Masters . There is a kind of competitive market that the American story presumes — competitive, every actor having limited power over us. This book tells the story of the undoing of that market. #Competition

  16. Episode 3 - Stephen Kinzer from The Law, such as it is, opens in a new tab

    Sep 2, 20211 hr 24 min

    A discussion with Stephen Kinzer about his book, Overthrow . Overthrow tells the story of the many times the United States has intervened directly and militarily to change the course of government in other nations. #Empire America

  17. Episode 2 - Edward Snowden from The Law, such as it is, opens in a new tab

    Aug 26, 20211 hr 47 min

    A discussion with Edward Snowden about his new book, Permanent Record . In 2013, Snowden revealed to the world the extent of the US government's mass surveillance program. This book tells the story of Snowden's life and the decision to sacrifice as he did to let us know this truth. #Privacy

  18. Episode 1 - Andrew Bacevich from The Law, such as it is, opens in a new tab

    Aug 19, 20211 hr 6 min

    A discussion with Andrew Bacevich about his new book, After the Apocolypse . Bacevich is America's most thoughtful conservative skeptic about the scope of America's military empire, and the urgent need to redirect our focus. #Empire America

  19. Season 2 Intro from The Law, such as it is, opens in a new tab

    Aug 12, 202110 min

    This is an introduction of this season and ideas that the season will explore. Anti-empire, privacy, and competition: these ideas, or as I will call them, values, represent the best of who we've been; they are also values we've betrayed. These conversations are part of the research for a possible new book. Explore the ideas with me, and with your feedback, help me think them through.

  20. EP 4 - Case Closed from The Law, such as it is, opens in a new tab

    Jul 1, 202032 min

    In a surprising twist, the New York Times changed its headline and lede. In this episode, Lessig explains the decision to withdraw the case.

Ranking source

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Observed September 20, 2026.

Apple and Apple Podcasts are trademarks of Apple Inc., registered in the U.S. and other countries.

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